Ukraine is supported by the western empire for the same reason Israel is, it’s a glorified US millitary base in the region surrounded by geopolitical adversaries. Russia will not stop their advance while they are clearly winning, and the Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics already voted to join the Russian Federation. The idea that there will be guerilla resistance is just unfounded, Kiev has been at war with the Donbass region for a decade.
Europe is increasingly being demoted from imperialist vassals of the US Empire to periphery countries. Europe has very little hard power compared to the major players in the world stage and is utterly dependent on the US Empire’s hard power. The soft power Europe has is slipping as well. No amount of your homophobic pejoratives will change the fact that Europe doesn’t bring much to the table despite being the loudest ones there, and that’s why they are in fewer and fewer international talks where major powers are involved.
There won’t be any resistance as there hasn’t been any when the Russian first attacked without declaring war in the first place. I remember in 2022 before the invasion: “Russia will raise its eyebrows and Ukraine will understand” “the Ukrainian and the russian are brotherly people and we will be saluted as liberators when we will march into Kiev”. How did it ended up for your heroes, tankies?
Also, seeing Ukraine as a military outpost for the USA when no military bases where on their land but Poland was a few km away must be the funniest cope I’ve ever read. Please do go on, I really need some laughs
The people of Donetsk and Luhansk, who voted to join the Russian Federation, seem to be happy with the way the war is going. Kiev was ethnically cleansing them since 2014, after all, so that checks out. As for Ukraine being a glorified millitary outpost, again, it’s similar to Israel. Ukraine gets arms from NATO, is cozy with NATO, and is in general a highly millitarized country. Poland is also governed by the far-right, this isn’t the grand own you think it is. Europe since the end of World War II has been subservient to the US Empire, that isn’t new. What’s new is Europe’s demotion from vassal to periphery, which is an ongoing process accelerated in recent years.
Ah yes, the famous “free referendum” held under gunpoint, how could I forget??
Also, can you cite any source for the “ethnic cleansing” being perpetrated by the Ukrainian against the russians since 2014 in the Donetsk and Luhansk? Because the UN from when russia was still sitting in the council reports something completely different…
Ah yes, the famous “free referendum” held under gunpoint, how could I forget?? Also, can you cite any source for the “ethnic cleansing” being perpetrated by the Ukrainian against the russians since 2014 in the Donetsk and Luhansk? Because the UN from when russia was still sitting in the council reports something completely different… https://share.google/XaamDlq40m8hEDyOG
Cowbee replied to you and included links to some propaganda websites, while your perfectly reasonable comment was removed because, looks up rule 1, you apparently weren’t “civil and nice”.
I spent the time fact-checking a few claims in that comment and one of the articles (first one I clicked on) in order to be able to confidently state what should be exceedingly obvious to all: Cowbee is intentionally spreading propaganda with lies and distortions.
That puts all of Cowbee’s commentary into question.
In 2020, Russian-language schools were eliminated (in March 2020, Vladimir Zelensky signed the law “On Full General Secondary Education”, which eliminated Russian-language schools in the country from September 2020).
14/06/2020 The Ministry of Culture of Ukraine has decided on the candidacy of a new language ombudsman, proposing for this position the extremely odious Lviv activist Svyatoslav Litinsky, who “Called Russians “pig-dogs””
IT’S PROPAGANDA, BECAUSE: In June 2020, the Ministry of Culture considered potential candidates for the position because the first ombudsman, Tetyana Monakhova, resigned. Svyatoslav Litynskyi (Litinsky) was mentioned in media and activist circles as a possible candidate. He was never appointed. The position ultimately went to Taras Kremin (appointed July 2020), a far more moderate and mainstream figure.
05/08/2020 Irina Farion said that the Russian-speaking citizens of Ukraine remained “beyond the country’s historical paradigm.” “Their historical homeland is Muscovy, I really want them to be comfortable there. They must pack luggage – and go there. “They shoot us with their language”
IT’S PROPAGANDA, BECAUSE: Irina Farion was a fringe extremist voice, not a representative of Ukraine or its government. Her statements reflect her ideology, not state policy, and using her quotes to claim persecution of Russian speakers is deeply misleading.
01/07/2021 The Verkhonva Rada adopted the law “On the indigenous peoples of Ukraine”, Russians were not included in the indigenous peoples
IT’S PROPAGANDA, BECAUSE: Russians are not classified as an indigenous people because they have an existing nation-state (the russian federation). This means that they are considered a national minority, the same as hungarians or romanians, and not an indigenous people. This is standard international practice.
In 2014, the future president of Ukraine, Zelensky, spoke to the Ukrainian military, who were carrying out a punitive operation in the Donbas. Zelensky said from the stage: “Guys, I bow to you that you are protecting us from all sorts of scum!”
IT’S PROPAGANDA, BECAUSE: Zelensky did say words to the effect of: “thanking soldiers for defending Ukraine and protecting civilians from armed militants.” In some recordings and reports, phrases like “захищаєте нас від усякої нечисті / всякого бруду” appear. This is colloquial Ukrainian/Russian slang, roughly meaning “armed thugs,” “criminals,” or “violent militants.” Crucially: He was not referring to civilians. He was not referring to Russian speakers. He was not referring to Donbas residents as a group. He was referring to armed groups fighting Ukrainian forces in 2014.
I encourage everyone to be vigilant against propaganda, and to avoid falling into the gish gallop trap that is commonly used. Take a short amount of quality time to pick one lie or one distortion of the truth apart, then call the poster/commenter out on it to ensure it isn’t left unchallenged, then move on with your life.
I included links to valid sites, as well as to entirely western sources. It sounds like, more than anything, you’re upset with the facts at hand and how they are presented. A key example from yourself:
01/07/2021 The Verkhonva Rada adopted the law “On the indigenous peoples of Ukraine”, Russians were not included in the indigenous peoples
IT’S PROPAGANDA, BECAUSE: Russians are not classified as an indigenous people because they have an existing nation-state (the russian federation). This means that they are considered a national minority, the same as hungarians or romanians, and not an indigenous people. This is standard international practice.
Russians are the ones native to the Donbass region, which was added to Ukraine only a century ago. The fact that the Russian Federation exists does not mean that ethnic Russians aren’t indigenous to the Donbass region, and as such deserve special protections, and certainly not the ethnic cleansing they are subject to.
Same with phrasing Ukraine’s language laws as a ban. It isn’t a lie, you’re just more upset with those that take issue with Kiev cracking down on Russian speakers and are getting caught up in the phrasing. Ukraine is cracking down on Russians, and Russians were obviously upset. You’re doing the same thing people who try to claim there’s no systemic racism in the US because the laws don’t explicitly target people of color.
As for the person you’re defending, they admitted to being a Euronationalist:
A racist:
A dehumanizer of slavic people:
And defended their homophobia by saying I need to learn more about my own pansexuality:
You’re defending an anti-communist, Euronationalist, homphobic racist. In other words, the archetypical fascist, who is in this case trying their best to minimize the crimes against humanity of a far-right neo-Nazi regime that is ethnically cleansing their territory of Russians.
I encourage everyone to be vigilant against propaganda, and to avoid falling into the gish gallop trap that is commonly used. Take a short amount of quality time to pick one lie or one distortion of the truth apart, then call the poster/commenter out on it to ensure it isn’t left unchallenged, then move on with your life.
Russians are the ones native to the Donbass region, which was added to Ukraine only a century ago. The fact that the Russian Federation exists does not mean that ethnic Russians aren’t indigenous to the Donbass region, and as such deserve special protections, and certainly not the ethnic cleansing they are subject to.
Indigenous peoples are generally understood as populations that pre-date modern states and empires in a territory, with continuous cultural, linguistic, and social presence prior to colonization.
ie. not indigenous. However, as a recognised minority, russian speakers are afforded protections, along with other minorities.
Before 2014, and before the russian military sent troops and equipment to back separatist proxies, there wasn’t a war in Donbas. The loudest culture war arguments between russian and Ukrainian identity mostly played out among politicians and oligarchs who found them useful. For ordinary people in Donetsk and Luhansk, 2013 looked pretty normal: work, school, family life, sports. Life wasn’t affluent, but it was peaceful.
What changed everything was Russia’s direct military involvement in 2014. By supplying weapons, fighters, and command support, on the basis of exaggerated or outright false claims about threats to Russian speakers, it turned what had been political tension and limited unrest into a real war. Russia’s intervention, not everyday life in Donbas, is what destroyed the stability people had.
The Donbass region was added to Ukraine only a century ago, and prior to that was Russian, with Russians living there predominantly and was culturally Russian. Legally Kiev pretends to offer protections, but in reality post 2014 when the west couped Yanukovych and installed Banderite Neo-Nazis, Russians in Ukraine have been the targets of ethnic oppression and slaughter.
Ukraine ethnically cleansing the Donbass region, which popularly supports Russia, is what started the war. The Euromaidan coup is what kicked off the war in 2014, Russia entered in 2022 after the Minsk agreements failed. Had NATO not couped Ukraine, the war would have never happened.
Russia did intervene, correct, after the west couped Ukraine and installed a Neo-Nazi regime.
Yanukovych was not overthrown by force. His authority collapsed after the use of lethal force against protesters, which resulted in more than 100 deaths and triggered mass defections from the Interior Ministry, individual police units, and regional administrations. After losing effective control of the security apparatus, Yanukovych left Kyiv and then Ukraine, ceased exercising presidential powers, and failed to fulfill his constitutional duties. Ukraine’s Parliament, including a large number of members from his own party of Regions, then declared him unable to govern and scheduled early elections. This reflects abandonment of office followed by parliamentary succession, not a coup.
As for Donbas, its earlier inclusion in the Russian Empire is irrelevant under modern international law. Donbas became part of Soviet Ukraine in the 1920s for political and economic reasons, remained within the Ukrainian SSR for nearly seventy years and was recognized as part of independent Ukraine by all parties (including Russia) in 1991. Borders established at independence were legally binding and internationally guaranteed.
Before Russia’s intervention in 2014, there was no armed conflict in Donbas and no evidence of genocide. Civilian life was normal by any reasonable standard: functioning schools, elections, media, and commerce. Claims of genocide appeared only after the conflict began and originate almost entirely from wartime propaganda sources. The simplest and most verifiable fact remains that the region was peaceful before Russian military involvement.
Russia initiated a war on false premises and later expanded it into a full scale invasion, resulting in hundreds of thousands of casualties and economic costs measured in hundreds of billions of dollars and euros / trillions of rubles. These outcomes stem from deliberate political choices, not historical necessity or defensive obligation.
Are you able to cite sources who are not completely forgetful of the “green men” fighting against the Ukrainian state in eastern Ukraine before 2014 and being supported by put-it-in and the russian army? Because if not you should also be ok with israel when they say that Palestine does not exist and their land should be owned by israelis because the bible says they were there 2000 years ago… Are you a zionist as well perchance?
Are you denying the evidence of ethnic cleansing, or are you supporting the ethnic cleansing because ethnic Russians are victims? I’m anti-zionist and anti-Banderite.
I am denying the “evidences” you so poorly presented as, before and during 2014, it has been proved and confirmed by put-it-in himself that the Donbass and Luhansk separatist militias were being funded by the russian state in order to try to undermine Ukraine sovereignty in those regions while also keeping the animosity between the russian and Ukrainian people alive. Any kind of analysis which does not consider this data can be simply seen as russia propaganda.
Ukraine is supported by the western empire for the same reason Israel is, it’s a glorified US millitary base in the region surrounded by geopolitical adversaries. Russia will not stop their advance while they are clearly winning, and the Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics already voted to join the Russian Federation. The idea that there will be guerilla resistance is just unfounded, Kiev has been at war with the Donbass region for a decade.
Europe is increasingly being demoted from imperialist vassals of the US Empire to periphery countries. Europe has very little hard power compared to the major players in the world stage and is utterly dependent on the US Empire’s hard power. The soft power Europe has is slipping as well. No amount of your homophobic pejoratives will change the fact that Europe doesn’t bring much to the table despite being the loudest ones there, and that’s why they are in fewer and fewer international talks where major powers are involved.
There won’t be any resistance as there hasn’t been any when the Russian first attacked without declaring war in the first place. I remember in 2022 before the invasion: “Russia will raise its eyebrows and Ukraine will understand” “the Ukrainian and the russian are brotherly people and we will be saluted as liberators when we will march into Kiev”. How did it ended up for your heroes, tankies?
Also, seeing Ukraine as a military outpost for the USA when no military bases where on their land but Poland was a few km away must be the funniest cope I’ve ever read. Please do go on, I really need some laughs
The people of Donetsk and Luhansk, who voted to join the Russian Federation, seem to be happy with the way the war is going. Kiev was ethnically cleansing them since 2014, after all, so that checks out. As for Ukraine being a glorified millitary outpost, again, it’s similar to Israel. Ukraine gets arms from NATO, is cozy with NATO, and is in general a highly millitarized country. Poland is also governed by the far-right, this isn’t the grand own you think it is. Europe since the end of World War II has been subservient to the US Empire, that isn’t new. What’s new is Europe’s demotion from vassal to periphery, which is an ongoing process accelerated in recent years.
Ah yes, the famous “free referendum” held under gunpoint, how could I forget??
Also, can you cite any source for the “ethnic cleansing” being perpetrated by the Ukrainian against the russians since 2014 in the Donetsk and Luhansk? Because the UN from when russia was still sitting in the council reports something completely different…
https://share.google/XaamDlq40m8hEDyOG
Cowbee replied to you and included links to some propaganda websites, while your perfectly reasonable comment was removed because, looks up rule 1, you apparently weren’t “civil and nice”.
I spent the time fact-checking a few claims in that comment and one of the articles (first one I clicked on) in order to be able to confidently state what should be exceedingly obvious to all: Cowbee is intentionally spreading propaganda with lies and distortions.
That puts all of Cowbee’s commentary into question.
I decided to look at just one of those websites, https://sarahwestall.com/yes-its-true-evidence-of-genocide-crimes-against-humanity-towards-russians-in-ukraine/, which has the following claims:
I encourage everyone to be vigilant against propaganda, and to avoid falling into the gish gallop trap that is commonly used. Take a short amount of quality time to pick one lie or one distortion of the truth apart, then call the poster/commenter out on it to ensure it isn’t left unchallenged, then move on with your life.
I included links to valid sites, as well as to entirely western sources. It sounds like, more than anything, you’re upset with the facts at hand and how they are presented. A key example from yourself:
Russians are the ones native to the Donbass region, which was added to Ukraine only a century ago. The fact that the Russian Federation exists does not mean that ethnic Russians aren’t indigenous to the Donbass region, and as such deserve special protections, and certainly not the ethnic cleansing they are subject to.
Same with phrasing Ukraine’s language laws as a ban. It isn’t a lie, you’re just more upset with those that take issue with Kiev cracking down on Russian speakers and are getting caught up in the phrasing. Ukraine is cracking down on Russians, and Russians were obviously upset. You’re doing the same thing people who try to claim there’s no systemic racism in the US because the laws don’t explicitly target people of color.
As for the person you’re defending, they admitted to being a Euronationalist:
A racist:
A dehumanizer of slavic people:
And defended their homophobia by saying I need to learn more about my own pansexuality:
You’re defending an anti-communist, Euronationalist, homphobic racist. In other words, the archetypical fascist, who is in this case trying their best to minimize the crimes against humanity of a far-right neo-Nazi regime that is ethnically cleansing their territory of Russians.
I just did this for you, thanks for the advice!
Indigenous peoples are generally understood as populations that pre-date modern states and empires in a territory, with continuous cultural, linguistic, and social presence prior to colonization.
ie. not indigenous. However, as a recognised minority, russian speakers are afforded protections, along with other minorities.
Before 2014, and before the russian military sent troops and equipment to back separatist proxies, there wasn’t a war in Donbas. The loudest culture war arguments between russian and Ukrainian identity mostly played out among politicians and oligarchs who found them useful. For ordinary people in Donetsk and Luhansk, 2013 looked pretty normal: work, school, family life, sports. Life wasn’t affluent, but it was peaceful.
What changed everything was Russia’s direct military involvement in 2014. By supplying weapons, fighters, and command support, on the basis of exaggerated or outright false claims about threats to Russian speakers, it turned what had been political tension and limited unrest into a real war. Russia’s intervention, not everyday life in Donbas, is what destroyed the stability people had.
The Donbass region was added to Ukraine only a century ago, and prior to that was Russian, with Russians living there predominantly and was culturally Russian. Legally Kiev pretends to offer protections, but in reality post 2014 when the west couped Yanukovych and installed Banderite Neo-Nazis, Russians in Ukraine have been the targets of ethnic oppression and slaughter.
From davel’s compilation:
Ukraine ethnically cleansing the Donbass region, which popularly supports Russia, is what started the war. The Euromaidan coup is what kicked off the war in 2014, Russia entered in 2022 after the Minsk agreements failed. Had NATO not couped Ukraine, the war would have never happened.
Russia did intervene, correct, after the west couped Ukraine and installed a Neo-Nazi regime.
Yanukovych was not overthrown by force. His authority collapsed after the use of lethal force against protesters, which resulted in more than 100 deaths and triggered mass defections from the Interior Ministry, individual police units, and regional administrations. After losing effective control of the security apparatus, Yanukovych left Kyiv and then Ukraine, ceased exercising presidential powers, and failed to fulfill his constitutional duties. Ukraine’s Parliament, including a large number of members from his own party of Regions, then declared him unable to govern and scheduled early elections. This reflects abandonment of office followed by parliamentary succession, not a coup.
As for Donbas, its earlier inclusion in the Russian Empire is irrelevant under modern international law. Donbas became part of Soviet Ukraine in the 1920s for political and economic reasons, remained within the Ukrainian SSR for nearly seventy years and was recognized as part of independent Ukraine by all parties (including Russia) in 1991. Borders established at independence were legally binding and internationally guaranteed.
Before Russia’s intervention in 2014, there was no armed conflict in Donbas and no evidence of genocide. Civilian life was normal by any reasonable standard: functioning schools, elections, media, and commerce. Claims of genocide appeared only after the conflict began and originate almost entirely from wartime propaganda sources. The simplest and most verifiable fact remains that the region was peaceful before Russian military involvement.
Russia initiated a war on false premises and later expanded it into a full scale invasion, resulting in hundreds of thousands of casualties and economic costs measured in hundreds of billions of dollars and euros / trillions of rubles. These outcomes stem from deliberate political choices, not historical necessity or defensive obligation.
Here are some compiled by @cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml
https://www.sott.net/article/467441-Burned-alive-How-the-2014-Odessa-massacre-became-a-turning-point-for-Ukraine
https://21stcenturywire.com/2014/11/17/natos-nazis-ethnic-cleansing-their-opposition-in-east-ukraine/
https://sarahwestall.com/yes-its-true-evidence-of-genocide-crimes-against-humanity-towards-russians-in-ukraine/
https://commondreamsnews.com/the-donbass-russians-subject-to-unparalleled-ethnic-cleansing/
https://csegr.ru/discrimination-against-russians-in-ukraine-eng/
https://www.voltairenet.org/article184430.html
Are you able to cite sources who are not completely forgetful of the “green men” fighting against the Ukrainian state in eastern Ukraine before 2014 and being supported by put-it-in and the russian army? Because if not you should also be ok with israel when they say that Palestine does not exist and their land should be owned by israelis because the bible says they were there 2000 years ago… Are you a zionist as well perchance?
Are you denying the evidence of ethnic cleansing, or are you supporting the ethnic cleansing because ethnic Russians are victims? I’m anti-zionist and anti-Banderite.
I am denying the “evidences” you so poorly presented as, before and during 2014, it has been proved and confirmed by put-it-in himself that the Donbass and Luhansk separatist militias were being funded by the russian state in order to try to undermine Ukraine sovereignty in those regions while also keeping the animosity between the russian and Ukrainian people alive. Any kind of analysis which does not consider this data can be simply seen as russia propaganda.
Then prove and confirm it, all you’ve done is plug your ears while hurling racist and homophobic slurs.