What is going on with all of these people saying CEO’s or other employees deserve to live comfortably? The average salary in the US is like $64,000 the median is more like $38,000. What kind of person could possibly do the work of 10 or almost 20 (depending on weather you prefer median or average) regular people? If people should be payed based off how much work they do this is not a reasonable amount.
people saying CEOs*
What a scam…
Hey guys I help orphans on a non profit, I’m a very good person. BTW I get paid 1M a year
Non profits are not charities.
These salaries are quite low in the tech sector.
I would really love for some of the people here talking about how it’s a good thing this “talent” is retained to explain what it is exactly these people do. I am 100% certain they hate these people in their own companies. But somehow when they see it in an NGO corporate structure it’s all sunshine and daisies.
Guess adb never worked for a non-profit before.
adb is currently main developer for a fork of Delta Chat, a messenger that actually gives you privacy.
you got your messenger recommendation from congresspeople. think about that for a second and how it makes you look to technically competent people like us
But you do realize that DeltaChat also received a quite significant amount of money from the US Open Technology Fund over its course of development and to this day it is somewhat unclear how they fund what seems to be several full time developers?
Lol, I notice he didn’t say anything in reply to this.
Aw the mewling wittle baby is in love. I actually don’t use signal, but nice try. I do know a fair deal about the obscene income inequality and disparity in non-profits though.
Nice argument dude, unfortunately I don’t share your tendency to form parasocial relationships with US government-funded “privacy software” and prefer recommending open source projects utilizing extensible internet standards for longevity + reliability, so I’m unlikely to be convinced by your playground “what is he your boyfriend” antics. You’re clearly suffering from some serious cognitive dissonance, so take a step back. I don’t know you, I shared this with the community publicly in the hopes people can defend themselves better against surveillance. What motivates you, seriously? Why turn to personal attack? How did you end up at this point in your life?
My advice is learn how to take advice from people who know better than you. It can change your life, and it’s important for operating in communities that value authority from expertise rather than business jargon and ideological slapfighting.
US and the West are ‘managed’ by elite psychopaths that don’t give a shit about ordinary peoples ‘privacy’ or similar fancy tools for the wage-slaves. They have used these tools to try and break through specific nations/groups information defenses. ANYTHING sponsored by the US Oligarchy is either a part of local US control, or an attempt at reaching more people with rich-man propaganda in nations that defend themselves against US lies and color-revolutions…
I love signal and use I daily but I will admit the lack of self hosting is the biggest red flag for me. And that the servers are all in USA.
Unfortunately, I don’t have any alternatives that are as readily accessible and easy to set up to others. XMPP I guess is really the best bet for true privacy but a lot of people I talk to would be unable to grasp how to set it up and use it correctly.
LMAO @ everyone who would have denied this was true groveling at the feet of the US government’s spectacularly abd inexplicably generous Open Technology Fund after devoting 3000 comments to bashing what remains of Firefox for [checks notes] making the UI better so the community doesn’t need to spend their time making sidebars and vertical tabs… You guys are worms. Today I get to be the rock. 🥴
It’s a branch of the US military-intelligence-propaganda-industrial complex. Or was—I’m not sure if Trump’s executive order to eliminate it stuck.
JDPON Don strikes again. People got their hopes up too much when he acted like he was axing USAID programs. Just a change of management and perhaps some messaging.
I don’t know the intricacies of signal as a company or if they support any bad actors or whatnot, but I do hate to see flack for non-profit leaders and employees getting paid competitive salaries. Like if people are actually worth that much in the economy, why not try to stack the team so they’re incentivized to do well? Especially in the shit pot that is America.
I would be curious to see the spread of overhead between salaries and fundraising, outreach, etc to actually get their product out there. Because if those are balanced in favor toward actually running the business, marketing it well, and fundraising, I’d say these people more than deserve these salaries.
A CEO should be paid enough to live comfortably if you work at a non-profit, but if you need to be paid market rate then you’re probably not passionate about the position. When your job is fulfilling a public good rather than delivering shareholder value, that and a decently generous salary should be reward enough.
That said, I think Signal is better than Mozilla on this front, because they don’t have a long history of terrible decisions each of which coming with increased executive compensation.
EDIT: Also the CEO of Mozilla made 6-7 million per year (haven’t checked the new CEO though). Way more than Meredith Whittaker’s $750,000. So honestly Signal is an order of magnitude better on this front.
CEOs need to be constantly threatened with execution by a dictatorship of the proletariat
Also maybe no stock options like other corps? So more salary compensation
The company asks for donations while receiving funding from the US government and scraping metadata from activists. You people are absolute marks.
and scraping metadata from activists
You have proof on that?
and scraping metadata from activists.
And what does it have to with this?
I mean yes, it’s not ideal that they require a phone number. But how does that translate to metadata scrapping and especially from activists?
Edit: just looked closer and noticed that this is almost entirely the executive team. Duh. Obviously execs are overpaid as hell but for the size of Signal and the average exec pay this is hardly surprising
Tbh I’d much rather the money go to the employees than to shady stakeholders/investors
I feel like the takeaway here is that this is how much people SHOULD be getting paid and most of the time the rest is getting siphoned off by the capital class
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talk shit about a bad group chat app
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angry group chat descends on shittalking
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none of them have background information on Signal leaking metadata and even the entire message contents in some cases
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mindless NGO executive worship
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everyone clarifies they don’t value their privacy in the first place
We will be doing this again next week. It’s lovely. Nobody seems to understand the downside of demonstrating an entire community has zero combined expertise by demanding spoon-fed information instantly. Lacking any sources that could criticize Signal.
Do you think it could be related to sanitizing your websites with “anti-disinformation” strategies lifted directly from the people who spy on you & your family? No, no, that’s too far out. Inductive reasoning is impossible. You know this.
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is the argument they shouldn’t be paid money for their work? or maybe signal shouldn’t be hiring at competitive salaries for highly skilled labor?
Well, the only person on the list with “developer” in their title has the lowest salary, the executives are paid more. And you will not in a million years convince me that corporate suits are doing skilled work in a way to deserve more compensation than people actually making the product.
Well, the only person on the list with “developer” in their title has the lowest salary,
Unsurprisingly.
that’s a fair comment I don’t know what they do either.
having seen a few of these org charts this could be much worse. there are 4 salaries related to software and technical improvements of the app and platform.
most ppl underestimate what kind of infrastructure is required to make anything work at planet scale, including auxiliary functions. I’d be much more interested in where the funding is coming from.
Their job is to ensure the nonprofit doesn’t suddenly start making something which can actually help them hide from the US government. Which would be possible since they have the talent.
Unbearable: This was the last time i donated to signal. Next time i’ll donate to some small foss-projects.
How does this compare to salaries for comparable positions at comparable for-profit companies?
It’s kinda the point of donations that they can afford to hire people whose labor costs that much.
Ah another hitpiece on Signal huh? They must be doing a lot right.
well yes, taking millions from the US government to dupe people like you into slathering yourself in metadata is the right move. redditors will justify anything once locked into the circlejerk
Signal is the only way I’ve been able to get my friends and family onto an E2E messaging app. Before this, they were all using SMS and WhatsApp. Signal is how we survived ICE in Minneapolis and organized to stop a bunch of jackbooted fascists from kidnapping all of our neighbors and deporting them to unknown countries. I have a lot of respect for the folks at Signal as a result.
I get that you all are on better platforms or whatever, but I don’t appreciate the dismissive shit that I’m seeing in these replies. Especially when it’s about one of the first privacy-oriented apps that normies get started with. You have some information about Signal that shows it’s shitty or a honeypot? Great, then post it. I’d genuinely love to see it (and not in a “post it so I can argue with you like an annoying redditor” kinda way). But this shit about high salaries at a non profit is not convincing to me and none of your replies here are doing your cause any service.
Literally all the shit talking in this thread is all from that guy. Lots of shit talking, didn’t link a single source to back it up.
The shittalking will continue until the encryption improves. It’s MY thread and you can’t have it!
K
my family and friends are intractable
You’re probably annoying + not my problem. You clearly aren’t very knowledgable about this, so I doubt you would even be able to explain it to them. XMPP and Delta Chat are easier to set up. You’re just arguing that laziness is a virtue.
Signal is how we survived ICE in Minneapolis
Serious “it was revealed to me in a dream” shit that most people would think was excessive if I made it up as a joking example of Signal defenders. Signal is funded by the US government and collects + leaks metadata. The US government uses metadata to target hacking of the device itself. Metadata is more valuable for surveillance than message content, it is used by police + intelligence to fabricate evidence of “terror networks” including teenagers in Chicago texting each other. Minneapolis drove out ICE because they had guns and physically planted themselves between the psychos and the people they wanted to terrorize. If they were stupid enough to use Signal (or encouraged by people like you) or bring their phones downtown, they will be mopped up before they can do anything useful. Fortunately for the feds, Americans barely even bother to walk around with signs.
The ability of these companies to operate centralized services in countries that serve gag orders should make things obvious, but fortunately you people have been trained by social media to require epistemological proof of wrongdoing.
blocked
we calling signal a multi billion dollar company now
the whole context here are the insane payouts for the execs
I have tagged you as Putin Apologist
I don’t know why you think I would care what some random troll on the internet tags me as. Sounds like you should work on your narcissism.
Those are normal salaries for a tech company.
those are not normal salaries for people working on regular open source projects though
If we’re going to continue doing capitalism, we need to celebrate when people who are responsible for quality products are paid comfortably but not so much that their pay disrupts other peoples’ status.
700k very much qualifies in today’s world.
Stop being crabs in a bucket.
Guy who wants to continue doing capitalism
If you want to change capitalism structure, tearing down privacy tools is not the way to do it.
How much does the equivalent salary at Whatsapp pay?
The average WhatsApp Inc. executive compensation is $221,139 a year.The median estimated compensation for executives at WhatsApp Inc. including base salary and bonus is $221,114, or $106 per hour. At WhatsApp Inc., the most compensated executive makes $450,000, annually, and the lowest compensated makes $53,000
https://www.comparably.com/companies/whatsapp-in/executive-salaries
That’s definitely wrong. The head of whatsapp is almost certainly an E9 level or above employee, most likely above. And the average E9 makes like $4M a year
Of course don’t tare down privacy tools. But they don’t need 700k a year, that’s an unreasonable amount of money that should really be redistributed.
an app designed to harvest phone numbers isn’t a privacy tool lmfao
Seriously so much this!!!
These people have a great product and they should be paid enough to keep them from seeking other sources of income. That’s how we got Facebook. Plus having the numbers publicly available is a big plus.
You guys are out of your gd minds I’m not going to sit here and explain what a mode of production is to you, or that executives are not proletarians. Jesus H. Christ
If we’re going to continue doing capitalism
You missed part of my post.
If shit was spread equally, everyone would make >$500 grand a year.
You ought to be tormented by ghosts of Filipino tuna fishermen for such a remark. Firstoids are completely delusional.
That is a wild amount of hate.
FWIW not on income but on top wealth, Musk has $792 Billion (ffs…) so ~$1000B and we are 8.4B Earthlings so ~10B. If we were to spread equality his wealth (which I’m all for) it would “only” gives each of us ~$100. Conclude from that what you will but to me it’s just a reminder of just how many people we are. A lot.
PS: this isn’t about income and it might be totally different there. If you have a better metric and approximation I’d be all ears.
Isn’t 1M per year upper middle class in america now?
Oh look the Americans are here to pretend that highly-paid tech workers are normal human beings. I wonder if that has anything to do with the demographics of the Reddit-fuelled Hitler instances. Worth consideration. 🤔
I’ve been reading this thread for way too long looking for you to post a single fucking link or source for your claims. You’ve typed thousands of words and 99% of them are insults to people that are just asking where you got these ideas from. Looks like you’re only purpose is to slam signal without proof. Why?
Damn, I don’t think I’ll make 1M in my lifetime combined.
My nephew, uncle and I have all had medical bills at $1M each
That’s because you live in Europe and stretching a month’s paycheck is easier than a week’s and the Euro is an strogner currency with better anti-gouging laws.
To sum up, 70k euros a month is a lot.
To sum up, 70k euros a month is a lot.
Even 10k euro per month is a lot and will be far better than most other people in Europe and allow you to live more than comfortably.
70k euros a month is insane
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage
We need to find a way to fund critical FLOSS. No, not like that!
40,000$ per month is way more than anyone will ever need. For sure I would stop donating, from the top of my 1,400€ per month.
I agree that’s quite a lot of money. I’m not sure what if any the cap should be. I guess my attitude is that if they are bringing in so much money, and everyone working there is getting a fair cut… then power to them? I don’t donate either, though I’ve been using Signal since before it was called that. I remember when they first introduced calling as a companion app called Red Phone.
I’ll agree it’s high, but then you have absolutely no idea what they do or have to put up with. Non profits should put the money they make above and beyond their expenses back into their employees, at all levels, not just the top. If you can’t beat em, join em!
My point is merely that they don’t need my money, nor anyone else’s. I am not familiar with the way 501c3 nonprofits work in the US.
I think that’s precisely what this is questioning : is this helping fund critical FOSS?
What if a fraction of that money instead went to Signal infrastructure? Wikimedia? FSF which initially made GNU PG? FSFE? NLNet which supports Delta Chat? Sovereign Tech Fund? etc rather than individuals?
I don’t think anybody is criticizing that hard working people contributing to a good project are well paid. I believe the question is rather what’s the cost to OTHER projects when there is 1 project, not an umbrella projects which funds others (again like NLNet or the Sovereign Tech Fund).
What model are we reproducing and what’s the risk?
FWIW the question isn’t new. It happens also with Mozilla with the compensation of its C-suite staff, not the “random” software engineer.
I think it clearly is helping. Signal is a mature, polished project. It is first-class. The infrastructure is obviously well-funded. As for other projects, I also wish they had more money but I don’t think it’s useful to criticize Signal for the fact that they don’t.
