(this is my first post im new) ive noticed something no one seems to have a problem with. do you have this problem to? am i just doing something wrong?
i use a privacy friendly browser plus a privacy friendly os and use fingerprint spoofer/blocker. i watch videos on invidious. i noticed that the “popular” tab shows videos related to videos i watched before. even if i clear my cookies, or change my idenity in (offiscial) tor browser i still get recommended related videos meaning no matter what i do google knows what i watch. whats worse, if i go on invidious on a totally different device with a normal broswer normal os, i get the same videos. meaning websites know what videos i watch across multiple sessions but also multiple devices. im sick of this. it feels like i’ve tried everything, sacrificed so much connivence but no results.
(this isn’t a question spefecifically about youtube google or invindious just how to get webisites to stop knowing everything i do across multiple identities and every device i use)
Things I tried
*Proton vpn+librewolf(max security according to settings)+nosircpt+Ublock(with the filters it comes with)+ officisal recommended invidious instances+Quad9 via settings
*Tails+Tor browser(max security settings apprentaly)+default bridge+no javascirpt+fingerprint spoofing estendsion+bluetooth disabled by tails+all the previous mentioned (exculding vpn i heard its risky)+invidious again (Tails doesn’t work well for me the police are not after me and it takes so long to start and presisent stoarage is annoying)
*Qubes+Whonix vm+Tor browser(max again)+no javascript (I love and hate qubes from my first impression it meets my security needs and you can run any os in a vm on it but i wish it just worked. theres a steep learning curve and my hardware isn’t the best for it)
No results on any of these just slower internet and some websites are broken. Its just like using a normal browser that tracks you but slow as a privacy one. im getting tired of this. i use all this super deep level paranoid overkill stufff and nothing happens. like im burning my house to get rid of a spider but the spider is still there
possible causes
-google wireless access point (does qubes/whonix/tor NOT protect against this at all??) (also my family HATES any changes or mild inconveniences)
-i logged in to google without a vpn **ONCE **does this automatically doom you forever **even ** if you change os and browser and device?
-hardware is framework laptop
for clairtiy
I am not -a criminal -a journalist -a gooner -willing to go off grid in the woods I am -creeped out -tired -about to give up
My privacy goals
-be able to actually cut ties with my shadow profile and have websites not know everything ive done in my life -control what data brokers and compaines knsw -not have any website at all know every device i use -be able to use any network safely
I feel like giving up on privacy because nothing seems to work. the only results I get is slower more broken internet
You never cleared your browser cache.
in most browsers cache is togehter with cookies. i also press new idenitiy in tor which apparently clears everything.
My experience has been the opposite, but I use firefox and do not experience the behavior you’re describing.
Hmmm very bizarre that none of those options are working for you. Those should be extremely secure ways of browsing the web.
Just to confirm, are you logging in to anything? Youtube and google can track you anywhere if you sign in to an account.
When you restart Tor and visit youtube, it should be asking you about cookies again. I make a habit of declining everything anyway.
Perhaps your Google access point is the culprit but it would have to be breaking encryption to affect your connection so surely not?
I’d recommend getting your hands on some bitcoin. Then you can convert it to monero and pay for a vpn that way. A secure vpn and librewolf should be enough to feel like you’re not being tracked.
yeah i dont log in to anything. i dont know how to use cypto to pay anonmyous for vpn and i dont even know if it would work because it feels like ive tried everything. everyone says these are super secure but im not seeing any results. the ad blocking is good but im looking for privacy as well like they promised
thanks for the comment it helps other people see this
OP, I’ve tried your experiment with Invidious + Tor browser. I’ve watched some vids about cooking. Then restarted Tor. Went back to the same Invidious instance. It didn’t show me any of what I watched. I got just the default vids for that instance.
Hard to say what might be doing that for you. So, afraid I can’t be of much more help about that :(
just how to get webisites to stop knowing everything i do across multiple identities and every device i use
It’s very hard. Unfortunately. You’re up against the best data scientists in the world. And up against a legion of identity brokers. Believe me they are very very clever. If there is ANY way to deduce ppl’s idenity they will find and exploit it.
I won’t say it’s impossible to do. But it’s one of those probs, where you have to block every method. They only need a single method you missed. On top of that, many sites won’t even let you in at all, if the identity broker server they use behind the scenes can’t peg your IRL ID with a threshold of confidence.
i think its only if google thinks you’d actually like the video and it proly can tell if youre trying to possion the data. i tried other completely unrelated topics but they didnt work but i watched a channel that google thinks i liked watching based. on the previous ones i watched (which im trying to clear but nothing works)
im not going to give up
thanks for the comment
i think its only if google thinks you’d actually like the video and it proly can tell if youre trying to possion the data.
I’m not too sure. For one, I do sometimes watch cooking vids for real :). But I can try with some other topics too, which I watch normally. Be an interesting experiment.
I suspect something else TBH. But I couldn’t guess about what since IDK anything about your setup and env etc except for your post.
thank you friend have a good dya
Invidious likely isn’t profiling you. If it worries you that much, you can stand up your own instance. It seems like a fun project.
That said, you absolutely don’t need to justify your desire for privacy here. I totally understand you. I’ve kind of landed on a “best effort” approach where I just try not to break shit but use as much privacy focuses stuff I can and check if my browser has a randomized fingerprint on EFF’s coveryourtracks.eff.org/, which you should visit. I use Helium and a small number of addons and that’s it.
Here’s the bottom line. You’re not going to be able to disappear on the internet without a massive and cumbersome effort which is not worth it relative to what I am gathering about your threat model. The very first thing you should do when considering privacy is 1. What you want to keep private and 2. Who you are trying to keep it private from. At the end of the day, you sound like me. I want to keep my browsing history and as much of my personal information as private as possible from data brokers, advertisers and my ISP. For that you need a layered approach. 1, VPN with no logs like mullvad. 2, Encrypted or at the very least recursive DNS resolver. 3, A somewhat randomized browser fingerprint. The last one is tricky because it’s actually just impossible. You can use stock librewolf to share your fingerprint with other users but imo that doesn’t work for my use case, as there are some pretty radical changes to the way I would have to use the internet, so I use Helium, which uses fingerprint farbling, and call it a day.
In the end, that works for me. It’s important to remember privacy is a spectrum. There is no such thing as total anonymity, everything you do to make yourself more private is productive and helpful. It’s about assessing your threat model and taking the correct steps, not trying to become a ghost, because that will drive you nuts and your internet browsing experience will be so degraded you might as well not even use it in the first place.
i dont believe that invidious is profiling me (sorry for not clairifying it) i know its google doing it despite everything ive tried. im not trying to just be safe from google. im trying to be private from compainies and hackers in general. i heard proton is no logs (though im skeptical) and i don’t want to pay for any services hosently since i dont even know if a vpn would work. ive also tried tor browser which says that it makes your fingerprint the same as other users and ive tried randomizer extenstions but still no results. ive also done quad9s dns via librewolfs settings. i dont think its fingerprinting because every device i own knows its me and shows that it knows what ive watched thanks for the comment
Have you considered it’s just guessing what people using anonymous stuff like?
kind of weird how anonymous people like the exact channels (with under 100 views) that i like and get recommended them at the exact time after ive watched them. i dont watch only thinls about privacy
thanks for the repli
First, are you saying convenience or connivance?
Also, other questions:
- you’re using a Google AP?
- What’s your “private friendly” OS?
- Are you signing into your browser by chance?
- If you’re looking at popular, I’d think that’s the same for everybody. Recommended would be based off what you watched, no?
yes i mispeled
1 yes my family likes it
2 ive tried mint, tails, and qubes(whonix vm)
3 no not at all (what crazy person logs into invidous??)
4 popular tab is based on what ive wacthed even if i clear my idenity. i faked an interest in a certain topic to expermient and im still getting the exact channel i pretended to watch to this day
thanks for the comment
If you are using a public Invidious instance it’s effectively still someone else’s computer so it could still be tracking you in some ways but if you’re using many of the things you’ve tried they should only be able to track things like your current IP and browser fingerprints which should not have any links to your other IP + fingerprint setups, google, or any other sites.
So what I think is probably going on here is a misunderstanding of how the “popular” tab works in invidious. It probably depends on which instance you’re using but the “popular” tab on your instance is probably showing what videos are “popular” on that specific instance. So the videos you see there would be based on what videos all users on that instance watch which would typically be biased towards tech and privacy adjacent videos. I’m not sure if your local watch history factors into that at all but if it does it would not follow you once you’ve change IP + browser fingerprints and if you go to a different instances you’re likely to see different “popular” videos.
yes thats how it should work i wish it did.
my question isnt about invidious specfically (sorry for the confusion) i just know that privacy os+privacy browser+anti-fingerprint+private frontend does nothing for me. i dont want any website knowing every interaction i make with it even if i change my ip, clear cookies, or change fingerprint.
also i had a feeling that google was tracking me through invidiuos becuase i watched a lot of videos from a niche channel then right after they were in the popular tab even if they had less than 100 views. i tested this by watching a channel of a topic i wasnt even remotely interested in and the exact channel i watched there after i cleared my cookies changed my tor circut and restarted.
kind of weird that most invidious users like the exact videos i watch at the exact time i watch them
thanks for the comment
To be clear are we talking about the popular tab on invidious or youtube?
If it’s invidious then the pool of users on your instance could be small enough that one person watching a bunch of videos could skew the popular tab results. The invidious documentation mentions that the feed is “generated from the videos that are popular amongst the users registered on your instance” so personal watch history probably has nothing to do with it and every user sees the same page.
If it’s youtube then the invidious instance you’re using could be just forwarding your traffic to youtube which would defeat the entire purpose of invidious but nothing would stop someone from setting up an instance that does that.
The easiest way to confirm would be to compare the popular tab with someone else’s device that’s never logged into your accounts or been on your networks…
Because again, if your IP and browser fingerprint stuff have been successfully changed websites have little to no means of tracking you reliably unless you tell them who you are. The sites that check your fingerprint have access to all the data sites like invidious or youtube have so if the fingerprint sites show different results on your different setups your tracking data cannot be aggregated. For this to not be true your setups would need to be completely compromised in some targeted way and or guesses would need to be made based on targeted behaviours/data, and if either of those were the case the holes in security would likely be used for more important things than syncing video recommendations.
Popular tab on invidious. But i also see videos related to things i watch on invidious on youtube.
i dont want any website to track me it be invidous or youtube but i still want to use them.
ive already compared it . Its the exact same as if im not even trying to be private :(
im not scared of syncing video recommendations. the video recommendations is just the crak that i see in my privacy (the thing that proves im not private) idk why its like this
if google (or other websites and services) can know everything ive done They can do bad things. i want to stop that
